New Missions

[Tarus]

I want to add this on a second post just so it's not lost



basically the biggest reason it needs to be done like this is an OOC one


but thats my biggest thing.. SOLAG and s-13 are almost indistinguishable sometimes in what they can do... and while real world wise.. yeah having the mixed talent would be great...

In a RP setting hit's much much harder because it takes away play opportunity from one or the other.


to be able to validate both groups ability to perform and function one needs to be focused more on the espionage and subterfuge, the other the harder and more sensitive combat

this would create a distinction between branches, and allow more RP's specifically tailored for one group or the other to be created.



as you can tell this has been a headache from day one oocly I will admit Im getting so much feedback, concerns etc in all directions " scrap solag, scrap s-13, merge them, make them more different, make s-13 public , no dont make them public. " that Im really needing as much time as I can be aforded to get a balance.

For sure. I understand that it must be hell taking over for Jiang. Like I said, I won't do anything rash for OOC reasons, but I'd like to get some roleplay going. If it makes things easier, I could take over more of S.O.L.A.G.'s duties - given that all I do now is make missions. I'd just like to get the ball rolling before the timeskip, not after.

 

[Lavi]

I'd like to point out that S13 will get kind of dull if we're limited to espionage and covert operations. A little big bang every now and then is a good change in pace. Just some two cents.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

SOLAG should start looking into other things for before the time skip other than the Hutts. The cease fire that Santoro has agreed to has absolutely nothing to do with the IC peace treaty, because that hasn't happened yet. Santoro has just been generous enough to give the Republic time to fix itself, because it needs time to do that OOC now rather than right after the skip.

So any SOLAG missions against the Hutts would be spitting in the face of Santoro's OOC cease fire agreement.

 

[Empress]

I'd like to point out that S13 will get kind of dull if we're limited to espionage and covert operations. A little big bang every now and then is a good change in pace. Just some two cents.

oh totally agree..as said I see them more as spectres working as a lone individual or very small group at most.

that said there are combat situations where S-13 is a much more viable and logical choice than Solag is.

and that's also assuming there is not an s-13 agent or two already In solag under falsified records :CSly

 

[Lavi]

and that's also assuming there is not an s-13 agent or two already In solag under falsified records :CSly

Hohoho.

 

[Empress]

Well.. S-13 is suppose to be my eyes, my ears, and when need be my poisoned blade. Makes perfect sense to have them also saturated into our own groups just as much as having them bleed out and try to get into hutt groups, or working rogue etc....

The republic armed services is my fist... just when I take said fist, and light it on fire and deliver a haymaker, thats Solag.

 

[Tarus]

**** it. I want to sabotage a supply ship. S-13 can come if they want to. S.O.L.A.G. ain't part of the Republic. Hoorah!

 

[Empress]

*cough*

Note that SOLAG operatives are generally assumed to be outside the usual military chain of command, and will often refuse or ignore orders given by local commanders. This is not out of disrespect for the rest of the military, but rather SOLAG recognizing that their missions take priority and they can’t let their operatives fall under the jurisdiction of any other branch. SOLAG answers only to admiralty and executive branches. Namely that of the Chancellor and Grand Admiral. Though they are not " attached" to any one branch, when sent under the jurisdiction of a Admiral or General, they will be expected to act accordingly ( however may disregard orders that conflict with their primary objectives as stated by executive offices with little fear of major reciprocation)

with fuzz butts blessing

aka they are the best of the best in both branches of the armed services, taken and given special training as special ops rangers. When it's time to bring down the sky they will be the ones packing the explosives.

they will also all be given a communication scrambler. This will not " knock out" a planet or system coms right out.. as in many situations that will set off a red flag that something is wrong in that area.

what the device does is cuts off the com, after a delay in which it's monitoring current com patterns, and will then loop false com traffic for a period of time. this offers precious minutes of added time to operate without sparking any red flags.

 

[Tarus]

Ugh. I feel like this group has just been castrated. Everything that set us apart from a black operations squad is now gone. If we're on the leash of a Republic admiral, then what's the point?

 

[Empress]

not really.. if anything their over-site is just shifting from the senate to the admiralty.....well ....namely the grand admiral, bvut this also means for SOLAG that they get better intel and such passed to them.

S-13 intel passed though the chancellors office can be covertly passed onto the Secretary of defense ( grand admiral) as general Republic intel. Then passed onto SOLAG

so really they are getting more to do, and more vital intel. Oh yes they may be said " hey go with Admiral so and so, make sure you put tracers on any enemy craft / sabotage hyperspace beacon/ etc etc..

and admiral so and so says " defend the beach and wait for our walkers to come back" you can still say FU and do your initial objective.. and how you do it is still utterly up to you as long as it's done...

that is when under another command...which I see more as " on loan, but really using that fleets activity as a platform to do what they are needing to"

when acting alone it's still to their discretion.



OOCly and IC there is potential problems with 2 completely rogue and unattached groups as well.

We are outmanned, out gunned, and behind on technology, and Im busting my butt off to try and fix those things however between just coming into office, and getting a time jump prepped. and bringing Solag to the point of authority is a major thing it gives them more to work with than they would get with the senate. Gives more direct lines of intel, more access to funds and equipment, and more detailed tactical and logistical planning.
( this goes with revises to the battle system that staff are working on, and the old sty;e battle tactic and command I utilize)

 

[Tarus]

We got our intel directly from the Republic intelligence before, and we weren't overseen by the senate. We're not switching overseers, we're being given a new overseer. I don't fancy the idea of the galaxy's most-elite squad of soldiers having to wait on some cigar-smoking admiral to say "go".

 

[Empress]

Jamall Mohatu says (6:23 PM)
The point of SOLAG was that it was outside the Chancellor's IC control, and answered instead to the Senate rather than the military or the Chancellor's office

Jamall Mohatu says (6:24 PM)
but if necessary, I wouldn't mind seeing them put under the direct command of the admiralty
or some such
so, yeah, lol

the idea was to change it given were badly loosing a war and the senates been compromised and nearly wiped out... With this they have more military resources, and prevy to s-13 intel which the senate would NEVER have.

 

[Raif]

I like the way this is going, if I'm honest. I would even be in favor of a merger with s13 if it came to that. One way or the other, though, SOLAG = American Delta Force, and S13 = CIA black ops teams. Both groups are epic badasses, but s13 is more small unit and solag is big time.

This seems an even more fitting comparison when you consider that Delta, despite being hugely well-known outside of the military community, still technically 'does not exist,' despite that serving members have real names, service files, etc. CIA black ops folks don't have real names, files, etc. So the comparison between these real life examples and our s13/solag issue grows the more you look at it.

At least that is my take on it.

 

[Tarus]

the idea was to change it given were badly loosing a war and the senates been compromised and nearly wiped out... With this they have more military resources, and prevy to s-13 intel which the senate would NEVER have.

That doesn't make any sense. If you're losing a war, you increase the power of your covert units and send them to do as much damage as possible; take out a facility without leaving any traces to the mother faction, that sort of thing. The Republic is only weak on a galactic front - it is still far superior to the Hutts in its covert arm.

 

[Empress]

I've never once said or mentioned anything about weaking our ability for espionage. I've never said anything about stripping Solag or S-13 of their abilities to do what they do best, or not utilize them to the best of their abilities.

Seals, Rangers, Delta force.....all do things Solag do, and all tied to their government and to think they dont get away with more than other branches and departments could is insane.

espionage is vital, if not more vital than anything else. This has been stated historically over and over, this was proved with the culper ring in the American revolution, and outlined heavily by Sun Tzu with the 5 types in this art of war, vital to Alexander the great as he swept through Saudi Arabia on his way into India...

and I'm not taking away that ability. I'm streamlining the communication lines, and actually giving Solag MORE room to operate and give them information outlets they never had before.

Solag always was held to something, someone would always be liable for them, and that someone was the Senate, there is no way to avoid that, even if it's not said on paper, if they ****ed up...someone had to answer....

all I did is move that party into the area that ALL forms of branches merge. that is WHY I established the Cabinet.

The right hand was never fully aware of the left hand, while the head remind completely unaware of the feet... there were catastrophic failures in communication, in strategy, and an utter unawareness of whats going on overall.

this had to change, because we all saw how well it was doing for us.... and right now the way we are and whats happening.. too many uncheck agencies and groups is a major liability.

When said " hey solag, there seems to be alot of build up in this area....or...hey there seems to be tensions brewing between the Hutts and their allies_______ but it needs to be done surgically
guess whats happening, they will go deal with it as they see fit in the end. THEIR Plans THEIR system on how to do it... as well as more combat heavy things and assisting or leading tactical strikes...


And yes there are many plans already brewing for things that they would be the ideal go to group to take care of potential situations...or to help exacerbate situations.

Why are they not doing them NOW?

because there was a rather swift change in command and alot of rebuilding being done...for both us, AND the Bogan. There was a cease fire agreement so that we had the time to do so oocly and get things back in line.. We are still doing this, on top of working out things for the time jump. this includes detailing maps of who is where, figuring out if and who is likely for promoted, planning out the new defenses, getting a almost entirely new and highly upgraded navy in place, solidifying relations with the jedi, and incorporating them into the system.

and there is still more but we ARE on a deadline now of a few weeks while people finish up running stories things, cram in training with their masters, or in simulators yadda yadda... once that time frame ends, its go, and go big.



what your largest complaints are are matters of semantics in reality, the functions of Solag will change very very very little

this also coming before there has even been a chance to physically see it in use. If it's a matter of feeling like your loosing authority? well, I'm sorry, there always was a higher authority in place even before I was selected to take over. However unlike before I'm not a off hands faction leader.

I don't sit here and focus on fight fight fight mindless fight BWRRAAARRRR GUNZ!" I do really look at webs of possibilities, probabilities and various scenarios and all of which with webs of contingencies in place in case something goes wrong.

the best way to go about this and make sure everyone is on the same page is to streamline everything


I am not new to running a major faction, I have run them before and with some mild success, and am returning a older system that worked amazingly well back when we had major major battles, and had next to no ooc fighting about it....with some wondering if this may cut back on the problems, factored in with new combat rules that are being considered ( though I don't know what they are only that it was said there are changes being considered)

and yes as many Vets can tell you espionage and head games played a vital vital role before....granted " this time" I have to be more moral than that before character was... but the applied tactics and ability to control the pitch and momentum over the field AND our enemy is much the same.

also the mere fact that I wanted to keep you in command ( though I understood loosely why you were away) I wanted to give you the full chance to prove yourself. One bootched mission half finished before RL force the issue....didn't seem right to me to just " totally" purge I chose to wait. so that should say something about a desire to keep things rolling and be fair to you.

( though the mod thing, that was when I asked for mods to be temporarily purged while I rebuilt and got my Cabinet picked and in place...purging everyone was an over site.. and I've asked a few times for them to be re-instated where needed. )

so here is the thing...... We can actually wait to see these in use before making judgment calls, and if it does not work out as well we can un-do it in a simple single stroke of the keys.

or

there is the option that there is a splinter cell forms, under a new name as a indi group with distant ties to but not part of the republic whilst Solag remains the republics go to top of the line and legendary special ops marine/rangers

and many other options....


Ic'ly Hisako is a reformist.......she is reforming...... she is restructuring the republic's entire structure after taking notes from the stellar failures over the first Hutt war. She's not looking for anyone's resignation, but if they feel they wont be able to function under the system before it's even in place...that is their call.


All I'm saying is " wait and see how things work out. if not they can be changed easily that's the nice thing about being fluid and adaptable "


I'm not really meaning to come across sounding bitchy. It's not really what I'm trying to do, though yeah I will admit this need to argue about something before it's ever even put to use is coming across as condescending, and rather insulting. There is nothing stopping me from just saying " you know what, lets just scrap them and remake a new group" because that would be sooooo much easier than doing this.

but that's not fair to anyone more over when the changes would not be noticeable to them.


so lets just...wait and see ? alright, let things play out and if I'm mistaken that this will make things smoother, I'll be happy to change them in a heartbeat.

 

[Tarus]

Words.

I'm not worried about losing authority or anything, I just didn't fancy the idea of my men and I becoming lapdogs for a Republic senator or something instead of the no-holds-barred badasses. I feel like it looks bad when I promise my guys some missions blowing Hutt stuff up, only to be told that we can't do that because we're suddenly under someone else's command.

That would be a bit like Obama stepping in and telling Delta Force, DEVGRU, JSOC, or any of the DOD SMU, that they can no longer operate without his approval. If were basing this on British policy, then sure, the Prime Minister has control over the SAS, but so far, it seems we're going off of American chain of command, where a Delta Force-like unit (S.O.L.A.G.) wouldn't be known to the other chains in any way aside from its existence.

 

[Empress]

But again your instantly assuming this means they will do less. which is the furthest from the truth if anything they will be deployed MUCH MUCH more once the skip happens.

as for " NOW" there are other things SOLAG could consider doing and looking into that don't involve the Hutts, because I will not clear anything against them this moment because of the ooc cease fire that he was kind enough to allow so that Bac and I could get our factions fixed up and ready to go BEFORE the jump. As has been stated more than a few times.

 

[Brand]

But again your instantly assuming this means they will do less. which is the furthest from the truth if anything they will be deployed MUCH MUCH more once the skip happens.

as for " NOW" there are other things SOLAG could consider doing and looking into that don't involve the Hutts, because I will not clear anything against them this moment because of the ooc cease fire that he was kind enough to allow so that Bac and I could get our factions fixed up and ready to go BEFORE the jump. As has been stated more than a few times.

I *think* (and again, remember, THINK) that Tarus' problem is that even during a cease fire or in times when there wasn't even a war (check out the Cold War, etc.) Special Forces are always making moves, against the enemy. Asassinations, high value targets, all 'disapear' without clearences because the government (i.e., Grand Admiral and Chancellor) trust said CO. I believe that Santoro would understand covert operations because THEY ARE COVERT OPERATIONS.

As an independent assault infantry commando unit I don't think, their initial design, intended for them to ever need your clearence. If you're going to effectively change the rules than you should make an overhaul and not limit us under our old banner, in which we had more autonomy than now.

 

[Empress]

difference though.. is this is an OOC cease fire between the two with IC implications. Jiang had CARD arrange it just prior to his toasting of Mohatu. This was because I had a hell of a rebuild, and so did Bac. Santoro chose to be kind enough to agree with it so that we could get things taken care of.

so attacking the hutts now ic, even covertly is an ooc spit in the face at santoro for allowing us this time to get things done before the jump.

he very easily could have said no, and the timeline would be over right now with him capitalizing on how bad of shape we are IC'ly then turned on the Bogan sitting in orbit around their new place.


if solag needs kept busy, there are crime syndicates they could take out, there are indi factions they could look into who could pose risks there is training... there are alot of options still there to let the imagination go.

but from the OOC level as an agreement between faction leaders, there are to be no actions against the Hutts, they are not taking action against us, and same with Bogan. this will change once the boards are reset for the jump.. at that point the ic ( story) peace treaty is broken, and it's on.

 

[Tarus]

But again your instantly assuming this means they will do less. which is the furthest from the truth if anything they will be deployed MUCH MUCH more once the skip happens.

as for " NOW" there are other things SOLAG could consider doing and looking into that don't involve the Hutts, because I will not clear anything against them this moment because of the ooc cease fire that he was kind enough to allow so that Bac and I could get our factions fixed up and ready to go BEFORE the jump. As has been stated more than a few times.

Whest said it best. I'm not worried that we won't get to do anything - I'm just upset that we suddenly need clearance to do things. Like Whest said, we're special forces. We're most active during peacetime. Look at the CIA and KGB during the Cold War. Santoro isn't dumb; if S.O.L.A.G. didn't overstep boundaries and hit NPC targets - you know, did something aside from sitting around waiting for the timeskip - I can assure you he'd be OK with it.

And, to clarify, I'm not concerned about a 'loss of power' or anything of the sort. I'm not power-hungry. I just don't like my hardened squad of killers being retconned into just another group of Republic lackies who need permission to sneeze.