The Hope and The Change

[Shiuzu]

It was amnesia.

The dark descent?

But yeah, I had that avatar for a while, it was a thing Pros and I were doing, I had The Man with not Name, he had Kuwabatake Sanjuro if I'm not mistaken.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

I'll bite.

When Barack Obama took office, there were eight million American people out of work. And these people were not out of work because of the war in Iraq. They were out of work because the housing crisis tanked our economy. That was started by Chris Dodd of Goldman Sachs and Barney Frank (D), the congressman who ran a gay brothel out of his home.

Bush 43 warned us in 2003 that the housing bubble was going to burst unless Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee, followed his advice and recommendations. "These two entities — Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac – are not facing any kind of financial crisis,” said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts. ”The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.”

Representative Melvin L. Watt, Democrat of North Carolina, agreed.

”I don’t see much other than a shell game going on here, moving something from one agency to another and in the process weakening the bargaining power of poorer families and their ability to get affordable housing,” Mr. Watt said.”

This is a shallow understanding of the housing crisis. It was bipartisan failures, and a massive failure of the (mostly) Republican-backed deregulated Wall Street. I suggest you actually study the housing crisis instead or regurgitating nonsense.

According to jobs reports, in 2010, there were 26 million people out of work. And this is after Obama spent a trillion dollars to “create jobs.”

What is “the jobs report?”

Instead, Obama and the Democrats tried to stick us with Obamacare,and they continued spending. Now, I don't mind the fact that Bac shirked my question since ObamaCare hasn't been implemented fully yet, but the facts are that small businesses will be less likely to hire now that health care is forced upon them. "When implemented, ObamaCare will force most American business firms to offer government-approved health insurance to their employees or else pay new federal taxes for not doing so. This costly new requirement will make it more expensive for firms to hire workers in the future. Consequently, it will destroy jobs, and many firms are likely to slow down on hiring in anticipation of its implementation." (-) If the government can tell you you MUST buy health care or be heftily penalized, what CAN'T they tell you to buy?

Once again, you are speculating. You have no facts. It’s falling on deaf ears. We don’t know what the Affordable Care Act will do. It’s all estimates and speculation.

Then you have his failed business proposals and 500 million dollar photo ops like Solyndra, which the GAO predicted would fail in Sept. of 2011, which is when it went under, or his shell games with GM, which basically robbed or borrowed from “Peter to pay Paul.”

If you think everything the government backs is going to work, you’re an idiot. Like, seriously stupid and lacking any sensible concept of investment. Not everything the private sector invests in is successful either.

The Solyndra inventory is being thrown out. If “Mr. Thrifty” had a clue, he would sell off the remaining inventory and divide up the money from the sales equally and send a check to working taxpayers in the 50% and higher earnings group, which is about $33,500 annually. The $300/$600 tax rebate Bush 43 did in the Summer of 2003 jump started the economy after the economy tanked after 9-11 and liberating and capturing Hussein, taking him to trial and having him executed.

Also, Obama’s entire cabinet has quit on him in his first term. The only people that are left are embroiled in scandals.

That’s an abject lie. Holy ****, that is nowhere approaching the truth.

Energy Secretary Steven Chu is being investigated for Solyndra. Eric Holder is being investigated for Fast and Furious among other things, while turning a blind eye to Black Panther voter intimidation, despite video of BP’s at a polling place holding Billy Clubs, Black Panther apparel, and telling a potential a white voter to “get out of here.”

Partisan witch hunts, though I’ll give a pass for this one since that’s what opposition parties always do.

Now, his only economic policy is class warfare and a threat to raise capital gains taxes. This will hurt the country. 401k’s will tank, corporate profits will stall, and it will be hard for the middle class and average investors to make money in the market for their retirement/401k.

Talking point. Talking point. Talking point.

You’ve said nothing of substance here. “Class warfare” is a nice bumper sticker. It’s also bullshit.

Obama, along with his remaining cabinet members is financially inept, yet Obama comes on TV and tells us what a great job he is doing and how thankful we should be for his guidance and leadership because, otherwise, we would all be sleeping in our cars and standing in soup lines while Government spending as a percentage of the GDP continues to grow, as does unemployment.

Obama doesn’t say that. The stupidity of what you’re saying is physically painful to me.

even digging up Ronald Reagan and throwing some blame on him.

God forbid we take a look back in history at the policies that got us to the financial collapse of 2008. Spoiler alert: it started hardcore with the Reagan administration and the deregulation of the financial sector.

I was going to keep replying to the rest of this, but this post is literally too stupid to continue wasting my time on. Oh my God. Please actually study an issue and know what you're talking about before you debate it. Informed people can have reasonable disagreements about issues, but you're not even informed. Talking points memos are a waste of time.

 

[jpchewy01]

I rather like class warfare...

 

[Venom]

I confess that view is probably due to only now starting to look at the political campaigns more closely now that I'm old enough to vote. I apologize for any offense given.

Eh, if you're looking largely at your local politicians, it could still be pretty true. Local politics seem to purely be "He agrees with Obama, he is bad. " (There are so many ****ing flat out lies that it's getting ridiculous in my area.)


Anyways, had a bit of trouble convincing myself to watch the video after I saw the group that's producing it. The video itself seems largely irrelevant, kind of like they asked random people to read off of a teleprompter.(c wut i did there)

Also, cant tell if this:

But didn't he pass the policies he wanted anyway, like the stimulus and ObamaCare for examples? and they still failed? I see Barack Obama running a dirty, negative, and dividing campaign because he can't run on his record.

was a serious statement or not, have you seen other ads? Have you ever watched an ad? Or listened to a politician talk? The idea that specifically Obama is running this sort of campaign is incredibly inane.

 

[Ser Gregor]

Bac, Pros. Flawless start, perfect execution, and amazing landing.

 

[Shiuzu]

That post was brought to you by Sprite.

 

[BLADE]

*Cracks Neck*

Let's do this.

When Barack Obama took office, there were eight million American people out of work. And these people were not out of work because of the war in Iraq. They were out of work because the housing crisis tanked our economy. That was started by Chris Dodd of Goldman Sachs and Barney Frank (D), the congressman who ran a gay brothel out of his home.

Actually that was started because of a weak regulatory structure on Wall Street dating back to the latter Carter years. Reagan and Bush and Clinton and Bush II accelerated the problem. Dodd and Frank were villains in the story but comparatively lesser ones compared to people like Senator Gramm or President Reagan. Unless of course you want to blame this on the Poor and the CWA. Books have been written on this. I wouldn't suggest anything too technical because you clearly can't think at that level yet, but there are popular tomes like Joseph Stiglitz' Freefall that do a good job of cutting through the jargon.

Bush 43 warned us in 2003 that the housing bubble was going to burst unless Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee, followed his advice and recommendations. "These two entities — Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac – are not facing any kind of financial crisis,” said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts. ”The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.”

Called it. The poors and the libruls are clearly behind this.

Except. You know. Not.

From Analyst Kimberly Amadeo

"Between 2004 and 2006, when subprime lending was exploding, Fannie and Freddie went from holding a high of 48 percent of the subprime loans that were sold into the secondary market to holding about 24 percent, according to data from Inside Mortgage Finance, a specialty publication. Even so, by 2007 only 17 percent of their total portfolio was either either subprime or Alt-A loans. Due to regulations, their percentage of these loans are actually better than many banks."

Or hell, check out this report from the Fed.

http://research.stlouisfed.org/wp/2012/2012-005.pdf

With that being said, both Freddie and Fannie were exposed in the market. So was everyone. The regulatory structure had been undone by lots of people including your crush, Sweatervest Torquemada, one of the most corrupt and in-the-tank Senators for Wall Street.

But it's okay because Jesus and Gordon Gekko are totes cool, amirite?

Representative Melvin L. Watt, Democrat of North Carolina, agreed.

Truly your powers of citation are impressive. One dude from the other party agreed with the President I Am Wrong About Everything.

You got me there.

”I don’t see much other than a shell game going on here, moving something from one agency to another and in the process weakening the bargaining power of poorer families and their ability to get affordable housing,” Mr. Watt said.”

Which actually says nothing about Fannie and Freddie being the main levers of the crash.

According to jobs reports, in 2010, there were 26 million people out of work. And this is after Obama spent a trillion dollars to “create jobs.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...n-the-subject/2011/08/16/gIQAThbibJ_blog.html

I've also run my own regressions. See it helps to know things. I used that librul book learning (math major) to run a LOESS regression on manufacturing jobs, industrial orders, and income changes. I got about the same results as most of the other econometric models. There are legitimate arguments to be made from the it didn't work side particularly with regards to exogenous data modeling, but for the most part even their thesis relies on the magical inflation God resurfacing (and inflation is relatively low.)

Instead, Obama and the Democrats tried to stick us with Obamacare,and they continued spending.

Now, I don't mind the fact that Bac shirked my question since ObamaCare hasn't been implemented fully yet, but the facts are that small businesses will be less likely to hire now that health care is forced upon them.

No they're not, you gibbering buffoon. By definition you cannot say that. At best you can say that this limited business sample (and I take issue with a lot of the methodology here) estimated that some costs would increase. The study made no mention of a true net effect nor did it mention if this effect would be compensated by better job flexibility by decoupling employment from coverage (which the PPACA has.)

You literally have no idea what you're talking about and Bac did not shirk your question. He was too kind to point out that your premise is moronic and leading. I do not share that kindness. You're stupid and you should feel bad.

"When implemented, ObamaCare will force most American business firms to offer government-approved health insurance to their employees or else pay new federal taxes for not doing so. This costly new requirement will make it more expensive for firms to hire workers in the future. Consequently, it will destroy jobs, and many firms are likely to slow down on hiring in anticipation of its implementation." (-) If the government can tell you you MUST buy health care or be heftily penalized, what CAN'T they tell you to buy?

1. No evidence. Also hilariously biased source.

2. I almost feel bad for you since you're so out of your depth here. Allow me and my law degree and Duke Law School to enlighten you. There are at least four basis on which the PPACA is constitutionally limited without making up a nonsense argument about the government having unlimited power of compelling purchases. I went over this in length in the PPACA thread some months ago, but I'll just link and let you read yourself. Maybe some of the real-world information will penetrate that carefully cultivated layer of congealed stupid.

http://scholarship.law.duke.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=3076&context=faculty_scholarship

Then you have his failed business proposals and 500 million dollar photo ops like Solyndra, which the GAO predicted would fail in Sept. of 2011, which is when it went under, or his shell games with GM, which basically robbed or borrowed from “Peter to pay Paul.”

Yes. After the investment was made. As in a free market bet. As for GM, there are issues with its restructuring but this argument is so incoherent as to beggar my ability to mock you.

Just kidding. You're still stupid.

The Solyndra inventory is being thrown out. If “Mr. Thrifty” had a clue, he would sell off the remaining inventory and divide up the money from the sales equally and send a check to working taxpayers in the 50% and higher earnings group, which is about $33,500 annually. The $300/$600 tax rebate Bush 43 did in the Summer of 2003 jump started the economy after the economy tanked after 9-11 and liberating and capturing Hussein, taking him to trial and having him executed.

From Socialist rag The Business Insider:

http://articles.businessinsider.com...reation-rate-obama-administration-mitt-romney

This is ignoring the constitutional questions of Mr. Obama retroactively changing funds to dispense as he sees fit. Nixon tried something similar and called it impoundment. I do have to congratulate you on these sorts of posts. It's like every time I dig deeper there's a new kernel of stupid to digest.

I'd say it's a tres leches cake of fail, but the GOP hates Latinos.

Also, Obama’s entire cabinet has quit on him in his first term.

Except that's not true.

The only people that are left are embroiled in scandals. Energy Secretary Steven Chu is being investigated for Solyndra.

By paragon of integrity Darrell Issa. For a year now. Who has found no wrongdoing.

Eric Holder is being investigated for Fast and Furious among other things,

Program started by Bush.

while turning a blind eye to Black Panther voter intimidation, despite video of BP’s at a polling place holding Billy Clubs, Black Panther apparel, and telling a potential a white voter to “get out of here.”

See it may be because I actually know and am not scared of ooga-booga black people but I can tell you that the New Black Panther Party is sort of like the Lyndon LaRouche Party of black people. But hey whatever makes it easier for yourself to justify the structural racism of your butt-buddies.

Now, his only economic policy is class warfare and a threat to raise capital gains taxes. This will hurt the country.

To Clinton-era rates. I remember the stock market cratering and that summer I had to spend in body armor fighting off horders of similarly-armored people in mohawks for scraps of petrol and food. That was before Bush got in, of course.

401k’s will tank, corporate profits will stall, and it will be hard for the middle class and average investors to make money in the market for their retirement/401k.

It won't, it didn't, you need to get a girlfriend but you probably won't because you have so many issues that you admire the sexual politics of someone whose name is a synonym for the frothy byproduct of anal sex.

Obama, along with his remaining cabinet members is financially inept,

Evidence?

yet Obama comes on TV and tells us what a great job he is doing and how thankful we should be for his guidance and leadership because, otherwise, we would all be sleeping in our cars and standing in soup lines while Government spending as a percentage of the GDP continues to grow, as does unemployment.

When did he say this?

Obama begged us for the job. He promised us everything but the moon. He even promised us that the levels of the ocean would stop from rising if he were to be elected. What we got was the predictable train-wreck that his critics said he would be, only worse.

Yes he did promise a cap-and-trade bill based on Republican policies in the Middle Aughts/Late Nineties. Truly he is Black Hitler.

Obama is the Eddie Haskell (yes, I've watched Leave it to Beaver)

A fantasy of the 1950s which ignores the rampant SOSHULISM and has no black people? Gee, I am so surprised. I guess I Love Lucy was too ethnic for you.

of Presidents. He takes credit for good things, even if he had nothing to do with the outcome, and blames everyone and everything for his utter failure and ineptness to perform his job duties, often blaming his predecessor, even digging up Ronald Reagan and throwing some blame on him.

Because Ronald Reagan was a demented failure and if there is an afterlife and justice in this world, he's burning in hell or rather being forced to watch the terrible movies he starred in. Same thing really.

You may think Obama is a swell guy, but you can’t honestly say that he is good for the USA. I believe he is nothing more than a slick-talking BS artist, aided by a teleprompter.

Right. No other politicians use teleprompters.

I’ve seen great leaders. Maybe not in person, and I most certainly haven't been alive for many, but I’ve watched them give hour long speeches filled with substance spoken without a script or a teleprompter.

I'm sorry Junior. There are lots of things you can't really claim to have done: kissed a girl, had to shave, etc. So why should I give a shit what you think about the charisma of leaders? Hell, why should I bother pointing out that pretty much every single politician gives stump speeches with teleprompters?

They can do this because they are espousing the principles and beliefs of their heart.

Whereas Obama is a fanatic extremist who believes in nothing but... Seriously. The Ooga-Booga bullshit isn't even consistent. Like I said. Pick a caricature and stick to it.

People like Obama don’t have an original thought, nor is he passionate about his principles and beliefs, thus the need for a teleprompter and the numerous gaffes that the networks will never show you.

Yes, yes. The Lamestream Media is out to get you. Here's the thing, you sniveling little pustule of fail. I'm to President Obama's left. For the most part I don't approve of his policies. I'll be voting for him as a lesser evil. But one thing I've done with most politicians is that unless I have their actual words to go by I don't go on some lame attempt to psychoanalyze them.

But yes. The first Black president of the Harvard Law Review (and sure, Harvard isn't Yale, where we're all atomic supermen) is a mediocrity. You keep telling your Rick Santorum plushie that.

They will replay Sarah Palin saying “refudiate” 24/7, then have a panel filled with liberals or mostly liberals talk about how stupid she is.

That's because she is stupid and because the only reason mouth-breathers like you listen to her is because she has a purdy smile.

Then they will run an internet poll after spending 24-48 hours tearing her down for a minor verbal gaffe while they ignore our Commander-in-Chief making huge verbal gaffes about putting hospitalized kids on “breathalyzers” (YouTube it!) and calling our US Navy Corpsman “Corpseman” several times. (YouTube it too!)

*Sighs*

Every politician makes gaffe you twit. The difference is that Sarah Palin is transparently stupid.

He may be an educated adult, but he is most certainly not intelligent, nor does he have any common sense.

I look forward to a scan of your medical diploma in psychiatry allowing you to diagnose Barack Obama. Also too the receipts of his therapy sessions. And then of course a justification for breaking patient-doctor privilege.

“If I don’t get this thing turned around in three years, I don’t deserve a second term.” - Barack Obama. True story.

Lesser of two evils. True story.

You know people often think that I have fun tearing idiots like you a new cloaca online, but the truth is that when the arguments are this pathetic, I actually feel a little bad. I just picture this weird family in the middle of Rural Assholetania force-feeding you this bullshit and I just feel sad. Because you're just a kid. And while your parents are probably irredeemable assholes at this point, maybe if you don't go to Randian Jesus University you might not grow up to be such a ***** adult.

Or maybe not. Congratulations either way.

Wanna cookie?

 

[Brandon Rhea]

The thing with Sarah Palin in the media is also not because of a liberal bias. It’s because of two key things. One, she asserts herself as a media figure (FOX News analyst and what not) and a leader in the Republican Party, but only when it’s convenient for her -- i.e., only when she’s not saying something dumb that she has to defend. Then she acts as if she’s not part of the media, as if that gives her the principled high ground from which to preach about how the big bad liberal media is going after poor wittle her.

And the bias of the media is not liberal. The bias is towards laziness and sensationalism. Liberalism that seeps in, which is much less than Rush Limbaugh would have you think, is not as a result of a coordinated effort to help liberals. It’s because whatever reporter is letting that liberalism in is just being lazy, OR the person reading it who thinks it’s liberalism has no concept of the fact that their non-liberal beliefs may just be wrong on a particular issue.

Sarah Palin is great media fodder because of her big, sensational personality. She's an entertaining figure. People of all political persuasions can admit that. Obama has made gaffes, and the press reports on them a little bit, but they’re not entertaining. They're also few and far between. Sarah Palin’s gaffes are entertaining. Joe Biden’s gaffes are entertaining (we just had a week of stories on Joe Biden's "chains" gaffe). Those gaffes sell. They hook you in and make you want to see more.

A great example of how the bias of the media is towards sensationalism and not towards ideology is the Anthony Weiner scandal. That scandal was an absolutely pointless news story after the first 5 minutes of coverage on it. Anthony Weiner was a known Congressman, sure, but he wasn't an important one. The fact that Weiner tweeted a picture of his naughty bits is of absolutely no concern to anyone, save for perhaps his now-former constituents. It was a big story because it involved a dickish guy named Weiner tweeting a picture of his wiener.

Nancy Pelosi held a press conference during that scandal. It was widely assumed she was going to comment on the scandal. The cable news channels waited and waited for her to arrive at the press conference, speculating about what she would say while also bemoaning the fact that they were covering this instead of covering news about jobs and the economy (never mind the fact that they choose what to report on, not the mystical journalism gods who command thee to report on picture's of the Congressman's pee pee!). When Pelosi finally came out to speak, she said that she was not going to talk about Anthony Weiner and would instead talk about jobs and the economy. What did the cable news channels do? They cut away. Why? Because they didn’t really want to talk about jobs and the economy. They didn't actually care what she had to say about it, because that’s not entertaining. Weiner’s wiener is.

Then there’s also the corporate bias which is systemic as a result of the media being owned by corporations.

 

[BLADE]

Nobody would give a shit about Sarah Palin if the media didn't continue to prop her up, so the crying about the media from her is incredibly self-serving as is.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

Nobody would give a shit about Sarah Palin if the media didn't continue to prop her up, so the crying about the media from her is incredibly self-serving as is.

Good point. She has no real legitimacy within the Republican Party (case in point: she's not speaking at the convention), and she only has a small handful of supporters. She has fiercely devoted and loyal supporters, sure, but so do cult leaders. She doesn't have very many.

 

[BLADE]

I troll occasionally at Conservatives4Palin. It's not even that fun since those people lack the self-awareness to realize that I'm mocking them.

And she's basically Jim Jones but lazy.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

She's also not murdering people or compelling people to kill themselves, so that's fairly substantial difference between Sarah Palin and Jim Jones.

 

[BLADE]

She's also not murdering people or compelling people to kill themselves, so that's fairly substantial difference between Sarah Palin and Jim Jones.

Well that and I'm pretty sure she doesn't drink Kool-Aid.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

Kool-Aid is the drink of communists. Everyone knows that.

 

[BLADE]

Kool-Aid is the drink of communists. Everyone knows that.

That's why the official drink of the RNC is Tang.

This should not be construed as a pun to the effect that Tampa has some of the filthiest strip clubs in the country. Family values!

 

[jpchewy01]

Kool-Aid is the drink of communists. Everyone knows that.

It's our favourite beverage.

 

[BLADE]

Wondering what happened to Trell. It shouldn't take that long to copy-paste RNC talking points.

 

[Dmitri]

The discussion turned to MSN. Apparently states are fine to force health care on you, but not federal. Among others.

Aka, no progress.

ADMIN EDIT: Removed MSN convo.

 

[Shiuzu]

Wondering what happened to Trell. It shouldn't take that long to copy-paste RNC talking points.

You scared him off too soon. You need to work your way up to big posts like that. When you use logic it tends to scare them off.

 

[BLADE]

The discussion turned to MSN. Apparently states are fine to force health care on you, but not federal. Among others.

Aka, no progress.

No I get it.

When states do it = freedom

When the federal government does it = tyranny

That's why we don't have a national army. Hold on. I gotta go serve my time at the Colorado National Militia. The Fighting Rocky Mountain Oysters. We'll fry your balls.