Bogan Civil War

[Brandon Rhea]

You take away their ability to wage effective warfare and they become a non-issue in the galactic theater; garrison the port-cities, exterminate any dissenters, starve the planets, and let them fight for their ruined planets. Even if they took all three planets back their ability to wage war would be utterly ruined.

And the Hutts sacrifice forces from the war against the Republic in order to accomplish all of that.

 

[Ser Gregor]

And the Hutts sacrifice forces from the war against the Republic in order to accomplish all of that.

It isn't a sacrifice if the goals are achieved.

Also, Hutts have come out of pretty much every encounter with victory; they can afford to spare some forces from the war with the Republic.

 

[Cailst]

The Hutts declaring war on the Bogan is undoubtedly the single most stupid thing any faction has done on this website since its inception. I'm sorry, it's just absurdly stupid. It has nothing to do with anything that makes any real sense IC and has everything to do with the well known and unfounded OOC paranoia of the high ranking Hutt leadership.

Considering that the Hutt leadership came to power through treachery, I'd assume that they would be much more vigilant about the treachery of others, even going so far as to see things that aren't there. Like Macbeth ordering the assassination of Banquo.

Fixed.

If you think the Bogan can just be destroyed because of manpower and territory, you are sorely mistaken.

I'd imagine that if the Bogan could get their hands on the Hutt leadership, the rest of the Hutt Empire would collapse like the Aztec Empire or Incan Empires to the Spanish.

But if not, Hutt resources seem large enough that even with incredible victories, the Bogan would inevitably lose because the Hutts can lose far more than the Bogan in any exchange and yet still be better proportionally. Perhaps like the Pyrrhic War where Pyrrhus won several battles against the Romans causing more casualties on their side than on his yet unlike the Romans, he didn't have the overall manpower to replace the losses that he did incur.

 

[Santoro]

Didn't the Hutts just initialize peace with the Jedi and Republic?

There was no formal plea for peace. Tusa's statement was a ploy to get the Jedi and Republic citizens to support him, hopefully to stall any attacks while he deals with the threat but more realistically to build future support for his takeovers.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

Perhaps I'm overestimating what it takes to actually fight a war against another, relatively large empire, but I really don't think so. I think you guys underestimate the commitment the Hutts are going to have to make to do this, and how any forces diverted to the Esstran sector opens up doors for the Republic elsewhere.

P.S.
Banik also said in his interview (which is being used by the Hutts as a reasoning for all this) that the only relationship the Bogan were seeking with the Republic was the exact same one as with the Hutts -- don't step on my toes and I won't step on yours. The Bogan had absolutely no agreement with the Hutts to fight against the Republic, so that violates nothing that had been understood between the two sides.

I commend you for using my interview in a way in which I didn't anticipate, but I would at least hope that you'll admit that it's propaganda to justify Tusa's reasoning rather than his actual reasoning. Otherwise Tusa ain't too bright.

 

[Mars]

Perhaps I'm overestimating what it takes to actually fight a war against another, relatively large empire, but I really don't think so. I think you guys underestimate the commitment the Hutts are going to have to make to do this, and how any forces diverted to the Esstran sector opens up doors for the Republic elsewhere.

It's one sector is it not? Tha's really not that large in comparison to the strongest faction in the galaxy at this point. Republic's busy dealing with internal stuffs atm, there's no better time for the Hutts to do this than now.

 

[Ser Gregor]

Perhaps I'm overestimating what it takes to actually fight a war against another, relatively large empire, but I really don't think so. I think you guys underestimate the commitment the Hutts are going to have to make to do this, and how any forces diverted to the Esstran sector opens up doors for the Republic elsewhere.

I don't think you are, actually. However, the Bogan having 'billions' of soldiers, for example, does not translate to actual, effective military power. They cannot all be deployed. Not even half would be able to be deployed. The Hutts don't even have the bureaucratic or logistical capability to do that with all their resources and planets; Bogan have three planets.

The Bogan are limited by an effectiveness level the same as the Republic and Hutts; but because their resources are negligible compared to the other two factions that effectiveness level is much lower.

The Hutts could fight a simple war of attrition with the Bogan and still win.

I commend you for using my interview in a way in which I didn't anticipate, but I would at least hope that you'll admit that it's propaganda to justify Tusa's reasoning rather than his actual reasoning. Otherwise Tusa ain't too bright.

I really don't think anyone was expected to take that reasoning seriously OOCly; this is an excuse for the Hutts to act preemptively.

 

[Malon]

Perhaps I'm overestimating what it takes to actually fight a war against another, relatively large empire, but I really don't think so. I think you guys underestimate the commitment the Hutts are going to have to make to do this, and how any forces diverted to the Esstran sector opens up doors for the Republic elsewhere.

Ok, I'm getting back into this. I need to say something here.

IC'ly, you're right, it diverts attention. Okay.

The Hutt Empire, mind you, is winning against the Republic though. The Republic is losing badly, no matter what plan Adena is concocting at the moment and unless its membership gets a bit more active in the future, that's going to continue. The Hutts will likely pull victory after victory out of it if that keeps up, so they can afford to divert their attention to the Bogan.

All this talk of freeing up the Jedi is bull. The Jedi want the Bogan dead just as badly as the Hutts now. So now you have an "enemy of my enemy is my friend" situation going here. They will put aside their differences to kill the Bogan and then go right back to fighting each other.

 

[Sreeya]

Yeah, you're ignoring that Jedi were the ones to send Force Users disguised as Bogan..

 

[Brandon Rhea]

I don't think you are, actually. However, the Bogan having 'billions' of soldiers, for example, does not translate to actual, effective military power. They cannot all be deployed. Not even half would be able to be deployed. The Hutts don't even have the bureaucratic or logistical capability to do that with all their resources and planets; Bogan have three planets.

The Bogan are limited by an effectiveness level the same as the Republic and Hutts; but because their resources are negligible compared to the other two factions that effectiveness level is much lower.

The Hutts could fight a simple war of attrition with the Bogan and still win.

If the Hutts want to destroy the Bogan fleet and kill off a significant amount of forces, which they're certainly capable of doing and I'm not arguing that, then that still wouldn't accomplish the goal of preventing the Dark Jedi of the Bogan and surviving soldiers who view the Dark Jedi as gods from being a serious threat to the Hutts. If they fought a simple war of attrition and won, then that victory would only be part of the greater battle. They'd still have a serious Bogan threat on their hands, one they'll have to dedicate time, resources, and energy too.

Yeah, you're ignoring that Jedi were the ones to send Force Users disguised as Bogan..

No I'm not.

My point is that the Hutts seem to think this will be easier than it really will be. If their goal is to destroy the Bogan as an empire, they can easily accomplish that goal. If their goal is to eliminate some sort of Bogan threat, then that's going to be extremely difficult and require a lot of resources.

 

[Cailst]

Ok, I'm getting back into this. I need to say something here.

IC'ly, you're right, it diverts attention. Okay.

The Hutt Empire, mind you, is winning against the Republic though. The Republic is losing badly, no matter what plan Adena is concocting at the moment and unless its membership gets a bit more active in the future, that's going to continue. The Hutts will likely pull victory after victory out of it if that keeps up, so they can afford to divert their attention to the Bogan.

All this talk of freeing up the Jedi is bull. The Jedi want the Bogan dead just as badly as the Hutts now. So now you have an "enemy of my enemy is my friend" situation going here. They will put aside their differences to kill the Bogan and then go right back to fighting each other.

But if the Hutts have now acquired a new enemy who wasn't that big of a problem to the Republic before, wouldn't it benefit the Republic to try to establish some sort of cooperation with the Bogan to fight the Hutts? After all, the Hutts have been far more of a threat to the Republic than has the Bogan.

 

[Malon]

But if the Hutts have now acquired a new enemy who wasn't that big of a problem to the Republic before, wouldn't it benefit the Republic to try to establish some sort of cooperation with the Bogan to fight the Hutts? After all, the Hutts have been far more of a threat to the Republic than has the Bogan.

Only if they want to royally piss off the Jedi.

 

[Sreeya]

They can try, but Bogan being located deep within Hutt space..I don't think they're gonna be much help to Republic.

 

[Santoro]

Only if they want to royally piss off the Jedi.

Jedi+Hutts vs Bogan+Republic?

Hmmm...

 

[Ser Gregor]

If the Hutts want to destroy the Bogan fleet and kill off a significant amount of forces, which they're certainly capable of doing and I'm not arguing that, then that still wouldn't accomplish the goal of preventing the Dark Jedi of the Bogan and surviving soldiers who view the Dark Jedi as gods from being a serious threat to the Hutts. If they fought a simple war of attrition and won, then that victory would only be part of the greater battle. They'd still have a serious Bogan threat on their hands, one they'll have to dedicate time, resources, and energy too.

They wouldn't be a threat, they'd be an annoyance that would need a bit of attention to keep from becoming a threat.

Like I've said before, if you completely decimate the industrial, economic, and military capabilities of the Empire, basically uprooting civilized life in the sector, anything left would be disorganized and incapable of becoming a serious threat to the Hutt Empire while the war with the Republic went on.

You could draw the analogy that the Bogan would become what Al-Qaeda is to America, but that would be false because the Hutts are nothing like America; they don't care about civilian casualties or 'rescuing' an oppressed people. They'd be fine with leaving the Esstran sector a veritable wasteland.

But if the Hutts have now acquired a new enemy who wasn't that big of a problem to the Republic before, wouldn't it benefit the Republic to try to establish some sort of cooperation with the Bogan to fight the Hutts? After all, the Hutts have been far more of a threat to the Republic than has the Bogan.

That would definitely make the Jedi enemies of the Republic.

 

[Cailst]

Only if they want to royally piss off the Jedi.

Secrecy? Or simply point out to the Jedi that the Bogan are the lesser of the two evils and temporarily siding with them could be beneficial. Kinda like the US siding with Russia against Germany because Germany was a more immediate threat even though Russia was bound to be the next enemy of the US. And further in the future, siding with the mujahadeen to defeat the Russians even though it would set the stage for the Taliban and Al Qaeda to step in.

Either that or a bizarre switcheroo where the Jedi side with the Hutts and the Bogan with the Republic.

 

[Demiurge]

Jedi+Hutts vs Bogan+Republic?

Hmmm...

That'd be a crapfest right there.

 

[Horizon]

Secrecy? Or simply point out to the Jedi that the Bogan are the lesser of the two evils and temporarily siding with them could be beneficial. Kinda like the US siding with Russia against Germany because Germany was a more immediate threat even though Russia was bound to be the next enemy of the US. And further in the future, siding with the mujahadeen to defeat the Russians even though it would set the stage for the Taliban and Al Qaeda to step in.

Either that or a bizarre switcheroo where the Jedi side with the Hutts and the Bogan with the Republic.

I keep getting this thought about how you were the gent who performed a hit and run attack on the Hutt Capital. Which I think everyone else advised against too. I can't really remember though.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

They wouldn't be a threat, they'd be an annoyance that would need a bit of attention to keep from becoming a threat.

Like I've said before, if you completely decimate the industrial, economic, and military capabilities of the Empire, basically uprooting civilized life in the sector, anything left would be disorganized and incapable of becoming a serious threat to the Hutt Empire while the war with the Republic went on.

You could draw the analogy that the Bogan would become what Al-Qaeda is to America, but that would be false because the Hutts are nothing like America; they don't care about civilian casualties or 'rescuing' an oppressed people. They'd be fine with leaving the Esstran sector a veritable wasteland.

Yeah, you're definitely underestimating it.

With that said, I think we've pretty much exhausted this one and we're now saying the same things over and over, lol.

P.S.
My saying all this wasn't an attempt to try and protect the faction I just got done leading. Banik's endgame involved (I say that because he'll obviously need to revise it a tad now) royally ****ing over the Bogan.
:CSly

 

[Sreeya]

Jedi+Hutts vs Bogan+Republic?

Hmmm...

Let's do it!