Faction Training and Ranks

[Brandon Rhea]

This concern is a valid one, which is one of the reasons I placed my Knight character as "just being knighted". I would opine that FLs suggest that for most newcomers. Perhaps I am stating an obvious assumption? I mean, someone like Raydo could start out as a mid-high level Jedi (or general or FL or whatever), but then Boli would have to be Noob McKnight.

I wouldn't want to go down that road. One of the benefits of starting everyone off as a Jedi Knight, especially in the beginning of the timeline where no one other than FLs/AFLs will have the higher rank, is that everyone is equal. If we're going into a system where some people have to be newer Knights then we're right back to a system where older members get preferential treatment. I would let people make whatever type of character they want. If someone who isn't as good of an RPer says that they have a very experienced Jedi Knight, that character's years of experience is still going to end up taking a back seat to the RPer's lack of RPing experience.

Having the concern is valid, but I think the concern itself is overblown. It ties right back into why there's so much risk aversion on the site right now: the fear of the largely mythical person who is going to come in and ruin everything for everyone. That almost never happens. There are checks and balances on the site to ensure that new character profiles are not over-powered, and with the changes we're making to tech and to the Force, there are now even more checks and balances.

 

[Raydo]

We're not about to be overrun by jerks who just want to kill everyone's characters or powergame the site.

I am not trying to be a doomsayer or anything, but I think that is exactly what you invite when you base everything off of risk and remove starting a character off as a beginner. Now, I will say I was not around for this "golden age" of PvP and risk taking heroism, so really I base my opinion...off my own opinion (Which I value pretty highly : p )

In the end, I am #teamSWRP4lyfe and am excited regardless.

**Edit: there were several post while I was typing this one...not trying to beat a dead horse. (Unless that counts as a PvP win for my promotion)

 

[Brandon Rhea]

I am not trying to be a doomsayer or anything, but I think that is exactly what you invite when you base everything off of risk and remove starting a character off as a beginner. Now, I will say I was not around for this "golden age" of PvP and risk taking heroism, so really I base my opinion...off my own opinion (Which I value pretty highly : p )

In the end, I am #teamSWRP4lyfe and am excited regardless.

The idea that we're basing everything off of risk is also a very big misunderstanding that seems to be going around. It's definitely because of differing perspectives too. I mean, I can understand that, for players who were introduced to the site in this timeline, our renewed emphasis on risk-taking can seem overwhelming and can seem like we're dropping a ticking time bomb into the new timeline.

That's not the case, though. We're not swinging the pendulum so far to the other side that everything is about risk. We're trying to find a balance again, a balance that has been lost by the site becoming too risk-averse. It was a massive contributor to the reasons why the second half of this timeline didn't work, and we don't want to see the new timeline and all of its potential squandered because there's no combat and no risk taking.

It's all about balance.

Plus, if you take a look at my announcement in the first post in this thread, you'll see that the words "risk" and "combat" aren't even in there. This change is all about getting people into the story faster, making people feel more important to the timeline right off the bat, and removing a barrier that turns a lot of good people away from our site.

 

[Marcus]

This change is all about getting people into the story faster, making people feel more important to the timeline right off the bat, and removing a barrier that turns a lot of good people away from our site.

Thanks for clarifying Raydo and Brandon, and this line above is especially helpful and sensible. Again, excited to get started and give it all a whirl!

 

[Rom]

I for one am going hunting with my super OP Death Knight of Doom. Fear me!!


Really though, this is all very exciting and I'm glad I'm rejoining the RP when the flair is on its way back.

 

[Sapphire Storm]

I would like to chime in and point out that several people who have complained of the grindy and endless progression to Knight are people who have not 1. Asked myself (or any of the current Jedi leadership that I am aware of) what they need to do to become promoted. And 2. Put in an application for promotion.

It isn't some overly daunting task. I think Reland was promoted to Knight after 12 or so threads. I had training threads but I also wrote them in a way where I was developing a character or a relationship. When I wasn't given missions, I made my own up. It isn't that hard.

The fact is, no has been promoted in the last 5ish months because no one has applied for it.

Just remeber, too much salt is bad for your health

Even though this was posted a bit ago, I do feel the need to point out that people that act like what you've described are always going to be around, regardless of the rules for promotion. I've noticed over my time RPing, and also gaming, that sometimes there are just people that want to have fun, but are too unwilling, afraid or unsure of how to go about doing it themselves. They wait for the fun to be dropped into their lap because they don't want to work for it and put effort into it or don't know how to work for it and put effort into it. Whether it's an MMO, a roleplaying forum or even an in-person game of D&D, there are always people like that.

I hate to be pessimistic, but these changes won't stop those people from acting like that. They'll still find a way to complain about not having enough to do, and probably other things I'm not thinking of at the moment. And why? Simple. They don't understand that if they want to have fun they need to put effort into it and that other people won't just organise everything for them and drop the fun in their lap. I have a friend IRL like that and it's extremely frustrating every time I see her complain of being bored when she's sitting on her phone and refusing to contribute.

All of that said, I am happy about these changes and I think getting rid of the current nature of promotion will help get rid of the overarching view that you have to train for months on end before you get to the fun, which will also help with getting people out of the previously mentioned mindset. To be honest I really didn't mind training threads. I found them fun. Anything that is an opportunity to expand and explore my character, even in the safe, "boring" confines of a classroom, is fun and worth it, in my opinion. But that's just me, and I can very clearly see the benefits of starting everyone off on equal footing.

Anyway, minor rant over. I'm excited for the new timeline and all the changes have looked really good so far ^_^.

 

[Raider]

I for one am going hunting with my super OP Death Knight of Doom. Fear me!!

Don't steal my characters please.

 

[Andreus Makaryk]

So there's murmurings about that the Force is gonna be nerfed and such to get the Force Unleashed type powergaming scenarios out. Think I saw somewhere that Force healing was gonna take a hit, cuz let's face it, running around and taunting five Dark Lords with "nah nah, you can't kill me, I heal2full!" (like I do in SWTOR) isn't cool. :D

But where will that leave people who want to do Jedi medic type characters? (And if we're going to have lots of battles, those types of characters will be useful and usually there aren't a lot of people playing them.)

Personally I'm thinking of Force healing resembling kind of a RL ER triage situation in potency...as in "I can keep you alive for the next couple minutes, maybe, but I gotta get you out of here RIGHT FCKING NOW, and disengage, before you bleed out on me. We'll be having lotsa fun in the medcenter together." Will we be hearing more on if these kinds of characters will even be allowed, and if so, guidance on doinitrite?

 

[Beta12]

@Andreus Makaryk Alternatively it would be interesting to see how a "Jedi Medic" would react without the ability to use the force to heal or keep someone alive. It would be interesting to see more of an actual battlefield medic sort of role, where a Jedi might have to resort to using medical equipment like pain numbing medication, bacta, some sort of biofoam, or whatever else resides in the medical realm of starwars.

 

[Saul]

I haven't heard that Force healing was super useful, but then again medics were never useful in forum-based PVP. Generally if someone gets hit, they die or get really hurt. People RP what happens to their own characters and don't often factor in what their allies do. Plus, if you're a medic, you'll be screwed in any 1v1 scenario. Also, I mean are people so resolute on gimping their character by forcing them in arbitrary archetypes that they are going to absolutely refuse to learn how to use a lightsaber because of illogical reasons like "My character wasn't designed to, I want to fry things with finger-lightning and nothing else." Even Sidious got stabby when he needed to, and the dude was old.

 

[Outlander]

I've seen people try to heal in the middle of combat, which ends up ending badly for everyone involved.

 

[Beta12]

I haven't heard that Force healing was super useful, but then again medics were never useful in forum-based PVP. Generally if someone gets hit, they die or get really hurt. People RP what happens to their own characters and don't often factor in what their allies do. Plus, if you're a medic, you'll be screwed in any 1v1 scenario. Also, I mean are people so resolute on gimping their character by forcing them in arbitrary archetypes that they are going to absolutely refuse to learn how to use a lightsaber because of illogical reasons like "My character wasn't designed to, I want to fry things with finger-lightning and nothing else." Even Sidious got stabby when he needed to, and the dude was old.

I'm thinking @Andreus Makaryk was talking more about main-battle PVE, after smaller PVP, or something similar later in his post. At least that is how I read it, since force heal can be used cheaply in both death-enabled PVP matches as well as more broadened and vague stories involving combat. I'm sure in a story outside of a strictly enforced Manaan style PVP there would be a lot more room for someone getting down and dirty with a med-kit, I don't think he was talking about inserting standard medics directly into PVP anyway, as the first part of his post revolved around self healing in combat situations.

 

[Saul]

Let's just say that people don't heal to full in RP. If you take a hit in PVP, you typically RP some catastrophic injury, or else you dodge or armor absorbs it. You don't RP a minor injury and expect your team-mate to come heal you, you assume they have better things to do. Someone tries to medic you, they are typically defenseless targets, which means they die. Healing in PVP in a forum environment is extremely difficult to do outside of PVE, at least insofar as lightsabers are involved. You want to deal with ranged combat, cover and blasters, medics become more possible.

I have nothing against people knowing Force Heal. It doesn't even need a nerf. It's already extremely underwhelming.

 

[Green Ranger]

I've always envisioned healing as a heal-over-time thing where the healer is more or less completely vulnerable while they try to patch up the injured teammate. So I don't think I've ever used it in PvP.

That said, come to think of it I don't think I've ever used Force Heal anyway at all, but still.

 

[Andreus Makaryk]

LOL. I specifically disavowed SWTOR-style heal2full. I think we all know that such would be OP.

The character I have in mind would have had medical training well before becoming a Jedi. I was definitely thinking something along the lines of what a combat medic IRL would be, and the Force would be little more than an augment to more established medical procedures. He would still have to replace severed limbs with prosthetic variants. Moreover, such character would not be averse to combat, and would probably be one of the few Jedi seen with a blaster sidearm. It would be difficult to extract a patient from the battlefield without the ability to defend such a patient after all, though if the battle takes long enough, the patient might die regardless.

The idea of RPing a Battlefield 1942 medic type character in the Star Wars setting has always held an appeal to me. Ultimately, though, if the idea of running a medic proves untenable, I could just go with a pilot. The person who asked me to come back will be disappointed, but I'm only willing to deal with so much drama.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

While I think the idea of a medic character is pretty entertaining, I'm not sure that it would lead to good roleplaying opportunities. Realistically in a thread what would you be doing? You couldn't really help people in the midst of an active PvP scenario, so you would be stuck responding when they lose said scenario. At that point I feel that it would sort of turn into a repetitive process of going through the basic first responder stuff every time, no?

 

[Rom]

Don't steal my characters please.

Each and every character under my command owes me 100 PC Scalps... And I want my scalps!

 

[Raider]

Each and every character under my command owes me 100 PC Scalps... And I want my scalps!

Bac is only one left who would get the joke isn't he?

 

[Kenico]

Sound good?

All: YES SIR!

 

[Brandon Rhea]

Bac is only one left who would get the joke isn't he?

I don't actually get it. >.>